The Coalition of the Swilling

Well John, I don't think it would be to burn down the French or German embassies. There's a difference between simply voicing a protest and barbarism.

THS-The WTC was the very first thing I thought of when I saw that pic.

Right you are about the reaction here, Dave. (The pic also stopped me in my tracks when I saw it. As in ::GASP!::)

That was a pretty weak comparison there, John (And Welcome to the Swilling, by the way! Glad to have you stop by.), as Christians/Catholics/Jews here lose their minds over the slings and arrows of a free society like clockwork. Pat Buchanon would be shootin' his mouth off (and does so routinely) anywhere they'd give him a minute's airtime, but he'd keep his lighter in his pocket.

Hmmmm. Nope, not going to do it.

Come to think of it John, there's a pretty revolting bunch in Kansas who claim to be Christians, but show up at funerals of miners and kids killed in Iraq. They carry placards with charicatures of Marines in homosexual sex, hateful language about fags, etc. As a Marine, I find it right up there with Jesus as a child molestor even withOUT it's display at a funeral, but no one's blown up their church yet. I don't think anyone at one of the funerals's even punched one of the a$$holes out holding a sign and Lord knows they deserve it. I do reserve the same freedom of speech to call them as I see them, though.

That's the difference. No one would here would be whipped into a frenzy by rumors spread by a priest in Poughkeepsie, but they are by a cleric in Karbala.

P.S. I did a little research for you. Google Jesus cartoons and see what you find. And there's no flames on the horizon or riots in the street.

Them and us. Night and day. 2006 and 706.

A.D., that is.

Dave,
True enough. But the point is, no newspaper anywhere in the West would consider for a moment doing such a thing, because it goes beyond propriety in the first place, not to mention that major Western newspapers have apologized for less.

But in the United States, John, people aren't knifed to death in the streets for their views. They are in Denmark. Theo Van Gogh would love to argue with your stance, but he can't. So I understand the Danish editor's motivations; attempting to break through the pervasive climate of fear and intimidation that anyone who speaks critically of Islam faces there. Sure they were inappropriate, but big deal. Say your piece, write a letter to the editor, don't buy his freakin' newspaper. Those are the APPROPRIATE responses for inappropriate cartoons.

Where is all the outrage when the Shiites blow up a Sunni mosque, vice versa or each other, which they also do routinely? Why isn't anyone after the Wahhabbists in Saudi Arabia when they've dug up sites linked to Mohammed in the Holy Cities?

That would be Denmark, with an N.

Got it, John ~ merci!

Tree,
So what you are saying is, that because someone was murdered somewhere in the world, the Danish paper is going out of their way to be a pain in the ass, simply for the sake of being a pain in the ass. And I think that pretty much sums it up --- they are picking a fight, they are looking for trouble --- and they found it. So now how far do you want to go with it? How far do you want to push it?
Remember the Cuban missile crisis? At some point in the midst of it all, one of the key White House players said something to the effect, 'what we need here are some rational, clear-headed minds' (sorry I can't remember the exact words or speaker). I hope this analogy does not appear to go too far, but this thing could get really out of hand real fast. And the last thing we need is people either trying to start or finish a fight. This thing is just a vignette within a much larger production, and it needs to cool down.

No, that's too simplistic; "someone murdered". I said it was a climate of intimidation ~ an atmosphere of fear for those who choose to criticize islam in any fashion in the whole of the COUNTRY. That's a far different matter than someone taking a pop at a single individual for a single thought. Theo Van Gogh is merely the face of the pervasiveness of the fear and the best example of the freedom the Islamic faction there feels to act on their beliefs. A free society cannot countenance the hurt feelings of one section being allowed to threaten the very freedom of that society. It's one thing to take offense at something, quite another to kill, burn, riot and use it to your political advantage to oppress the very society you willingly joined over it.

I think it's out of hand already, but in the Islamic world. And it's largely an undereducated, unemployed, fanatic rabble being led by lies (i.e. 'burning Korans in the city squares in Copenhagen') from the very people they place their faith in ~ their clerics. Everyone has an agenda in this. From the iman who took three fake extra 'cartoon's' with him on his trip, to the Iranians trying to undermine the Danish because they're taking over the leadership of the IAEA (and Iran wants attention on everything but it's reactors right now), this whole brouhaha has been orchestrated to inflame the Arab street. And it's just a pitiful testimony to the state of that street that such bullsh*t can do so in the 22d century.

And why do I say it's out of control in the Islamic world and not here? The NYT, for example, hasn't called for a Crusade cartoon contest have they? I heard Condoleeza Rice this morning call the cartoons 'offensive'. They've got Mohammed in a lit turban t-shirts for sale, but, like I said, there're people of poor taste everywhere and in chaos there is profit.

I do heartily agree with you that it needs to cool down, but that seems to be in the hands of the religious leaders of the Middle East. (And yeah, the Cuban Missile crisis IS over the top ~ but the quote's very true.) And it's a true shame, because even moderate folks want to believe in the 'religion of peace' mantra. But all they see are these wild eyed lunatics in print and on video and they think "Good God, what is with those people?' What must NOT happen is the suppression of free speech in those countries who enjoy such an incredible right. Free speech that is tasteless is no less precious than the free speech that condemns such tastelessness.

Lock'n load!

Um, that means something pretty specific to a Marine, John. What do you mean by it?

Them and us. Night and day. 2006 and 706.

A.D., that is.

Spot on, THS. The Islamists live in the past, and want to drag the rest of the world back into that pit. The rest of the Muslim world are either too intimidated or indoctrinated to responde appropriately. Europe is reaching the dhimmification stage now.

And I thought the photo was of the WTC as well.

When was the last time you heard of a leader of the "religion" of Islam denouncing violence against the west? When have you heard of "influential" or "respectable" Islamic clerics disassociate themselves from this jihad, beheadings of innocents, terrorist attacks, etc.?

You haven't.

When we stop the absurd policy of not targeting the religious leaders, then we'll finally make some progress in eradicating Islam from the face of the Earth. The Romans eradicated Carthaginian religions that required child sacrifice. The Christians eradicated pagan religions. We are now faced with the responsibility of eradicating Islam.

It can be done, and it should be done.

What I find rather confusing is that Muslims complain about the prophet mohamid being depicted with a bomb on his head how??? By burning and destroying buildings and lives that are in no way connected to the incident. I do not belive in God, Mohammid, Buddah or anything. Those that do are ingnorant in my opinion, but that is just that, MY OPINION. To kill and blow oneself up in the name of any alleged divine being is the opitiome of stupidity and ignorance. All muslims, christians, jews and whomever who believe that violence is the answer should be exterminated